The Actuary - Student Page

With regards comment from Gareth, I believe part qualifieds can have input to the rest of the mag. Don't think there's anything to stop you submitting an article say to the features editor, or letter page.

Maybe the differential is there so part qualifieds can quickly find things relevant to them but I'm sure they are equally capable of reading an index.

 

Tristan (the previous editor) actually did an article on this already, not too long ago:
http://www.the-actuary.org.uk/pdfs/06_10_students.pdf

Point taken. However I believe we mentioned persevering with online applications as ONE of the options that this student could follow, the other options being sending off CV + covering letters and joining a recruitment agency. Mailing direct to actuarial managers is a great idea - however when I was looking for my first job, I didn't have a clue who the actuarial managers were in the big companies (who do online applications), and you'd have thought with how busy the actuarial managers are that your CV would as likely end up back with HR or in the bin. After all, you'd only be one of thousands and thousands of other graduates. This of course stops being the case once you have some actuarial experience....

And yes, anyone can write into any part of the magazine - you don't have to be fully qualified to contribute to the features/letters page, nor do you necessarily have to be a student to contribute to the student page. May's student page will feature a letter from a retired actuary. And no that's not made up

 

Unfortunately Online applications are first filtered by the computer, then reviewed by HR. HR then either decide (a) who to call for interview (b) who's application gets to be seen by the hiring manager.

My problem with online applications are that they take too long, and provide no feedback. I knew someone who spent two weeks completing an online application, worked seriously hard at it, and got rejected within 24 hours of submitting. No reason was given, and they never enter into any correspondence. I've got a feeling that the only reason it took 24 hours is because they want to make a pretense of consideration. He was a good candidate too. He's now working in GI consultancy, one exam away from qualification, (he's only ever failed one exam).

I wish all graduates would boycott this wicked system.

One interesting point to note is some of the same companies who rejected my online applications, six months later would have liked to interview me. Out of principal I would not even consider them, I regret that they were unsuccessful on that occassion, and unfortunately I am too busy to give them any feedback!

 

Yup - couldn't agree more - I spent months during my final year at uni doing these online applications until I was sick of them and sick of useless HR people basically taking the p**s - I remember being told by one consultancy "yes you are invited for an assessment day", then "no, actually you're not", then "oh yes you are, please do come" and then after all the hassle - "sorry you haven't got the job, and we can't tell you why". I finally decided that passing my exams was more important - then I would worry about finding a job. I got mine through the CV and covering letter option.

The problem with graduates boycotting the system is that graduates are desperate for a job (well the actuarial graduates I know are anyway)! So unless someone else sets up a far superior system to the online applications method used by the big four and others, I think graduates would still feel the need to do those online applications....

 

Yes that's true. Desperate graduates are easy to take advantage of. Let's be honest, would any of us employed actuarial students stand for such an application process now? No we wouldn't!

For graduates, a boycott would be a bit like game theory. All (majority) of students benefit by boycotting the system, such that it's replaced by something better. However, if just one student breaks rank then they get the interview as they are the only applicant! "Job Seekers Dilemma" !

Perhaps someone could research which actuarial employers currently have the longest online applications. This system should then be compared to another company(s), who have a relatively easy application process (online or otherwise). Then the companies should be named in the Actuary and students can then make a more informed choice about who they really think is worth applying to. Perhaps some kind of graph could be drawn up reflecting "number of questions" vs "frequency of companies asking that many". Then place the top 20 actuarial employers on the graph so we can all see where they sit. Basically a name and shame routine.

I got my job (& numerous interviews) by cv too. I never got a single interview from a full-online application process.

.... and do you remember the moronic questions they ask? "Describe a time you influenced another person" or "Describe a time you worked in a team". They might as well of written "Please demonstrate your creative writing skills by fabricating an event you were involved in".

 

Idea for student page: Do an article on the new CA3 proposal?

 

Another idea for the student page

I joined the institute quite recently and although I keep hearing all about the Morris Review, have no idea what it was, what it said & the effects it is having. It would be great if the student page could feature a summary of it & some thoughts about it. You could suggest that some members write a wikipedia page on it, because its the first place I went to read about it, but its not on there.

 

Morris Review

RachelH, thanks for your suggestion.

If you'd like to learn all about the Morris Review, have a read here:
http://www.actuaries.org.uk/Display_Page.cgi?url=/news/morrisreview.html
It includes Sir Derek Morris' final report.

Hope you find it useful.

 

That was new to me too.

Thanks!!

 

New Blood needed...

By the end of this year, I would have been doing the page for 3 years... how time flies... and reading this post again was rather nostalgic of our early days.

Hopefully we've managed to make the page an interesting read over the past couple of years.

As advertised in the June 2009 edition of The Actuary, if anyone would like to take on the challenge of being student page editors, please drop us an email at studentpage@the-actuary.org.uk

Jean