Progress after CT exams - why do some people fail?

[scarlets]

How are people finding it after completing CT exams?

Reading through CA1 and a ST subject... well it doesn't seem scary at all, except for the sheer volume to deal with. Lots of repetitive concepts.

I'd rather read through these subjects than resitting CT4, CT5,CT6 ... let's just put it like that.

I'm not sure what story explains the pass rates for the post-CT exams. Are some pass rates low because people aren't studying as hard? This would be understandable as people are a few years into their job and may have more responsibilities or have to work more overtime perhaps. (Hopefully not a deliberate action from employers to stop them from qualifying!!!)

Or are they more difficult exams to pass than the CTs because they're more 'wordy'? i.e. has the profession attracted maths types, some of whom struggle more with 'wordy' exams?

In the past I've heard horror stories about people who've almost passed all the exams but couldn't pass one remaining exam for many years like the old communication one. And I know of very motivated knowledgable people who just couldn't finish them off after CT exams. Why? - I don't know.

 

[sonnyshook]

What subjects are you doing now Scarlets. Like you I have finished my CT subjects. I have already sat an ST subject ST6 which I did alongside CT8. I am doing ST5 presently. I will do SA5 or SA6 in October then finish the rest (CAs) by April 2012.

My assessment so far is that ST and SA subjects are boring to study and less formulaic to revise. ST6 is probably the most exciting because it is the most mathematical. I am really sleeping in most of my ST5 study sessions.

 

[scarlets]

CA1, ST1, ST2, SA2 in that order, not all at once!!!!

Yeah very little maths, lots of reading... I find some of it interesting though, some of it obvious and sometimes a bit repetitive.

But it does go wrong for some after the CTs that's for sure. I wonder for how many people that's true as one only really hears about the failures.

 

[sonnyshook]

. I wonder for how many people that's true as one only really hears about the failures.

I think to really understand you have to buckle down and look at the pass rates since 2005 and see if this is myth or fact. I have and know it is fact.

I think people are just stubborn to adapt their study methods to meet the requirements of the questions in the later exams. A student with a strong essay assessment type background might do well.

And also as long as you stay in the top 30% in most exams you are fine.

 

[scarlets]

Yes that makes sense.

Do you think many have motivational issues in general when they reach these stages?

I mean, some may be just tired of exams at this point having come off an Uni course then spent maybe 3-4 years studying on the job to get the CTs and feel they've hit a milestone and can ease off a bit. Others may stop caring about career ambitions and feel themselves quite comfortable as they are or don't consider more exams to be necessary at this stage. These exams hit people in their mid 20s to early 30s so maybe other pressures kill the motivation for many? Just wondering.

 

[Copen]

I've recently completed the CT's and at the moment I've decided to do all the CA's to get the Associate and then re-assess at that point whether to continue on.

I'm 31 now and it's not my motivation that has dropped but it's the available time factor and the feeling that I should be passed studying by now... !

Maybe I've got the wrong idea. Is it a little stupid to stop at the Associate level in terms of job prospects & career?

 

[sonnyshook]

Maybe I've got the wrong idea. Is it a little stupid to stop at the Associate level in terms of job prospects & career?

Is it stupid? Yes, because all the rest being equal an FIA will be picked ahead of you.

I'm 31 now and it's not my motivation that has dropped but it's the available time factor and the feeling that I should be passed studying by now... !

Well you are not really a student or just studying. You are an adult working fulltime who is advancing their career prospects by choosing to study in their own time (which is miles better than just working full time, not studying and having a stagnant career and limited career prospects). You should be proud of this. Many MDs who have become specialised surgeons or consultants do this in their late 20s and entire 30s - and they are venerated. Think of the regret you will have when you are 40 and feel you should have finished your Fellowship in your early 30s. Hell yeah, when I am 31 or 35 or 40 I will not be past it to do an MBA or PhD or anything that will help my career - No way.

 

[Approximately]

Try mixing kids into the pot and see how much fun it gets then! There's a lot of us in our 30s or even 40s still doing the exams.

The exams are just a hurdle to get through on the way to the next promotion, and one at a time shouldn't be too much of a burden to fit in with life, no matter how complex it's getting at home. I've spoken to enough people whose careers have slowed or even stalled and really don't know what they need to do to get on. I think it's rather nice to have a very clear idea of what to do next.

I've recently completed the CT's and at the moment I've decided to do all the CA's to get the Associate and then re-assess at that point whether to continue on.

I'm 31 now and it's not my motivation that has dropped but it's the available time factor and the feeling that I should be passed studying by now... !

Maybe I've got the wrong idea. Is it a little stupid to stop at the Associate level in terms of job prospects & career?

 

[sonnyshook]

. I've spoken to enough people whose careers have slowed or even stalled and really don't know what they need to do to get on. I think it's rather nice to have a very clear idea of what to do next.

This is very true. As trainee actuaries or actuaries are we are lucky to have a clear idea want we need to do for our career to advance, passing exams being one good example. Most careers don't have this advantage. Lawyers and accountants (even if they pass exams) operate in "demand type" job market. Actuaries on the other hand operate in a "supply type" environment.

 

[scarlets]

I've recently completed the CT's and at the moment I've decided to do all the CA's to get the Associate and then re-assess at that point whether to continue on.

I'm 31 now and it's not my motivation that has dropped but it's the available time factor and the feeling that I should be passed studying by now... !

Maybe I've got the wrong idea. Is it a little stupid to stop at the Associate level in terms of job prospects & career?

you're not too old man, have a nice holiday, forget the notes for a few weeks, have a nice Christmas then get back into it in the new year!!! surely these exams are easier for people with a lot of work experience anyway as you can relate it to things you've worked on

 

[Copen]

I'm hoping you're right scarlets. I'm not sure how much my 4 year teaching experience (career break) will help, but I've worked in both pensions and GI.

Thanks guys for your comments / support - there was obviously a tinge of frustration in my post!

surely these exams are easier for people with a lot of work experience anyway as you can relate it to things you've worked on

 

[didster]

I'm not sure how much my 4 year teaching experience (career break) will help

That may some of the more useful experience. Actuaries are constantly being asked to explain concepts to people. Crunching numbers only gets you so far, its the "softer" skills which become more important.

 

[tiger]

Wonder if there's any difference in passing with age of candidate, or with those who have passed CT exams (vs. those who come from college with exemptions).

 

[bystander]

Age is just a number. Don't let that stop you from going to the end. Do it at your own pace - I guess you are self funding so if you still want it, thats one less pressure.

As for CT v ST, one thing that is coming thru' the early mails is a thread about just reading. STs, CA1 isn't about regurgitation/memory. Yes you need the latter, but more so you need understanding and application. Thats whats really being tested. So my advice is always get a form of marking to get feedback. Its a totally different technique to the mathematical ones.

Get over that battle, and it becomes less difficult - I won't say easy. They aren't!