Disillusioned with my actuarial career.

[archimedes]

Hi,
I'm currently working for a life office, prior to this I worked in a pensions consultancy for a year. I am relatively new (been working 3 years in total) and am just about done with my CTs. It has been dawning me that I really don't enjoy my work, at all. The best part of my job, I feel, is the studying. I find the work very slow paced and monotonous, especially sitting behind a computer screen for 7 odd hours a day. There is very minimal people contact and I have rarely got the chance in the past 3 years to develop any management or communication skills. All I have done is number crunching, building spreadsheets and running models. I feel that the money is measly in comparison to more senior people in the company when it seems that they have it easy (2 hour lunch breaks, benefits that would be at the envy of many and basically talking to other people to ensure that work gets done).

Before I started work, I felt that I was more dynamic, outgoing, sociable and very able. I feel that the nature of my work (sitting behind a computer screen all day, barely any contact and communication with others) has somewhat embedded itself in me and it would take a lot more than "getting more involved" to get it out of me. I feel that my workplace is a comfort zone and that the work culture is very slack and laid back.

Before I make a career move, I feel that I am a bit long in the tooth to give up now. Maybe get at least the Associateship would hopefully be my passport out of an actuarial career.

BUT - what sort of career move can I make without having to take a huge pay cut without any experience in any of the other fields??
Things I would like about a new career:
- More people contact and communication.
- Occasional travel.
- A faster paced working environment (stepping out of the comfort zone).
- Working with a bigger population of junior workers.

If anyone can give a few tips on career choices or let me know somewhere I can get more information, that would be helpful.

Thanks

 

[Meldemon]

I felt the same around 3 years experience, and found that in actuarial the things you want only comes after some level of qualification (AIA, FIA). If you crave dealing with people and a dynamic environment you need to go into consulting (Management, Investment (although some modelling involved) or non-UK pensions from a UK base), or something entirely different (not my area of expertise I'm afraid).

The button pushing & spreadsheet building only ends once you have gotten onto a qualified level or have a bit more experience - which should be soon if you have 3 years experience.

If you stay with actuarial, the new graduates will soon bypass you on Excel & modelling as you start thinking on a "big picture" kind of level (someone always needs to do the basic calcs - need not be you). That said, everyone starts somewhere and in actuarial it means proving yourself as mathematically able before you can start testing yourself without the training wheels.

Try getting involved on the non-actuarial side - developing training material for new grads, documenting processes and *crucially* developing those processes, etc - this may test your limits and give you some more "people experience" than you currently have.

Ultimately, if you move, do so sooner rather than later - the longer you wait the bigger the salary cut and the harder the adjustment you will need to make.

 

[LouiseF]

Hi Archimedes,

It never hurts to ask your boss for more challenging work. Let him/her know that you're getting bored during the day. I'm sure there are projects/tasks that he/she is bored with now and would love to pass on to you. Just like you are bored with your tasks and want to hand them on.

I agree with Meldemon you are just now at the stage where you can become more valuable to your team than simply just running models. Go have a chat with you boss. Now is a good time for resolutions and new goals for 2009.

Good luck
Louise

 

[OneTwoThreeFour]

Things I would like about a new career:
- More people contact and communication.
- Occasional travel.
- A faster paced working environment (stepping out of the comfort zone).
- Working with a bigger population of junior workers.

IMO general insurance actuarial provides more focus on these areas (happy to be contradicted though?). More specifically perhaps a london market pricing role (not an easy role to get with no experience though)

That has certainly been my experience - in particular in comparison to pensions. Although some of this may also come with qualifying

However there is certainly still a large element of spreadsheet work. Presumably something like management consulting would have a lot less of that. I guess it depends what you're looking for - no modelling or less modelling.

 

[archimedes]

IMO general insurance actuarial provides more focus on these areas (happy to be contradicted though?). More specifically perhaps a london market pricing role (not an easy role to get with no experience though)

That has certainly been my experience - in particular in comparison to pensions. Although some of this may also come with qualifying

However there is certainly still a large element of spreadsheet work. Presumably something like management consulting would have a lot less of that. I guess it depends what you're looking for - no modelling or less modelling.

Cheers for the replies, 1234 (and Louise & Meldemon).
1234, to answer your question, well, that depends on the job. If the modelling gets monotonous, then maybe not. If there are other things to compliment the monotony, then it would be well worth a shot. But then again, moving to something like GI would be quite difficult for me (3 years total work experience in life & pensions).
I briefly researched management consulting, but I still can't get a rough idea of what a typical day is like for someone in a junior level. If anyone does know what this entails, it would be good to get some views.
I've also thought long & hard about something in the investment field (investment consulting, fund management, fund analysis) but in times like this, that would pretty much be taking a gamble with my career because the chances of getting laid off would be relatively high.

 

[OneTwoThreeFour]

I don't think moving to GI would be impossible for you - but I agree that it would be hard. I think the issue would be more that you'd moved disciplines once before rather than the 3 years experience. You'd have to show them you were really serious about GI.

In terms of investment you could maybe think about companies that give investment advice to pension funds (is this fund management)? You'd have some relevant experience and (completely guessing here) they may be less risky given that pensions funds need investment advice in a good and bad times??? But then you would come back to the whole "are DB pensions going to disappear" issue.

I used to work for a pensions company and they had a investment sister company which employed quite a few (ex-)actuaries. From the people I know I think they got a lot more client contact etc.

 

[Gareth]

Could be worse - you could be a zombie quant sitting in an investment bank working 24x7 in hope of not losing your job...

 

[bystander]

Could it be that its the company you are working for that is disillusioning you?

Others have mentioned chatting to your boss. Do you get any formal development reviews? Some companies do, some don't but these are an ideal opportunity to have a voice on where you go. One thing that may be an option is for you to work on a project that involves many departments. OK you wouldn't be project manager but there are really helpful skills you can pick up by working with others outside your immediate team and helps build your business acumen by seeing things from others perspectives.

Why not have a chat with a recruitment consultant? Some have actuarial and non depts so can be a huge source of knowledge. Its not a great time to move but they know what is out there and may be able to help ascertain whether your 'lot' can be improved simply by moving co. They possibly know where 'leavers' go. If you are geographically mobile, one of the key resaons people move is to advance their career because the opportunities they have where they are are restricted.

If you do leave the profession/move into the wider field, you may well face at least a short term pay drop. But at the end of the day, so long as you have enough to give you a reasonable lifestyle I'd rather be happy in a less well paid field than miserable beyond the pay packet.

As for associate it may get doors opening, but not sure if you want to keep the title and use it long term, you will need to pay your subs. Could be worth checking out.

Good luck with whatever you choose.