CP3 Pass List Sep 2018

Discussion in 'CP3' started by MindFull, Dec 13, 2018.

  1. WeHaveSalah

    WeHaveSalah Member

    58 still means the LOWEST pass rate the exam has had. Why should ~18% more people pass last sitting than this? They removed the word count just 2 days before, no marks for graph... The paper itself was so much harder than normal considering the sensitivity required as well. This is not going to be a realistic communication for an actuary.
     
    Alaric and almost_there like this.
  2. Infinity

    Infinity Member

    As you may be aware the Ifoa cannot administer these exams. I’m wondering when the FRC will take some action. The problem is that the people in charge are abusing their position
     
  3. almost_there

    almost_there Member

    Quite, and would be even lower if it wasn't for this alleged adjustment in respect of the technical problems. IFoA love talking about their alleged 'robust' and 'rigorous' processes, especially the guinea pig process to ensure papers are set at a consistent standard etc. but how can this be judged to be working when pass rates vary so much? Has anyone ever received a copy of the underlying documentation for these rigorous processes- not to my understanding.
     
  4. Geraldine

    Geraldine Member

    Yeah I totally agree - we're just never likely to be the ones responding to queries like that. We would more likely be providing the background calculations to some non-actuarial person in the much broader team - and they would be the professionals (or communications experts) that liaise with customers, doing all this sensitive communication.

    It's really so strange, so out of touch!
     
  5. patron

    patron Member

    Perhaps it was the April 2018 sitting that was the anomaly? The pass rate for this exam was very close to the pass rate for the previous September sitting.

    I agree about the weird choice of topic of communication. I hadn't done any past papers where the recipient has to be assumed to have no financial knowledge whatsoever - it's normally trustees, or accountants, or some other department in a financial company. I wouldn't be surprised if next time it was a more conventional situation.
     
  6. PeteC

    PeteC Active Member

    18% of the 1400 who took the exam is around 250 people, or £75,000 in exam fees if you'd rather look at it that way.
     
    almost_there likes this.
  7. WeHaveSalah

    WeHaveSalah Member

    That was the first sitting (with very little past papers), that explains the lower pass rate - the exam itself was actually quite easy to get over 70 in. The institute changed these exams so you could only sit them twice a year to encourage people to try harder... well now people are waiting to qualify on a nothing exam. This exam should consistently have a pass rate over 60%, like a CT/CP2.
     
    almost_there likes this.
  8. WeHaveSalah

    WeHaveSalah Member

    Looking at the examiners report - many marks are given for detailing the calculation to the customer, giving the rates to go with them! Do I now suddenly live in a world where intellectual property doesn't exist? I have never seen an insurer detail what loading every rating factor gets to a customer - you would get sacked. Bizarre. Unless that's what happens in life insurance?
     
  9. almost_there

    almost_there Member

    I thought the CA3/CP3 exam was meant to be an application exam, to test one's communication in a situation an actuary would likely find himself/herself in, or words to that effect- read the syllabus & guide to this subject. If this exam question was not doing that then it's not fit for purpose and may be a breach of contract on the part of IFoA.
     
  10. PeteC

    PeteC Active Member

    I've just had a look at the Examiners' Report and the solution attached.
    The pass mark was reduced from 60 to 58.

    I'm sure I'm not the only one here to think "How is my score more than 43 marks lower than this?"

    I can see where I could have dropped some marks - I explained the breakdown, but failed to provide such a detailed breakdown of the premium.

    That said, if I read my letter and this solution side by side, I know which one I think is better. I know which I would prefer as the customer and if I was judging them both. Maybe that's why I've failed twice and will fail again.

    I'd be interested to see how well Acted tutors and qualified Actuaries would have scored on these CP3 exams. I can only assume that they'd all smash it :s
     
  11. WeHaveSalah

    WeHaveSalah Member

    If they wanted us to ignore giving away intellectual property for the purpose of communication testing, they could have stated that in the paper. It seems wrong for actuaries to give out an insurer's IP, I assumed that was a trick the exam was trying to trap you into.
     
  12. WeHaveSalah

    WeHaveSalah Member

    Can someone from Acted please comment on their thoughts given all of the things discussed on this thread? It would nice to see a less biased view.
     
  13. almost_there

    almost_there Member

    Well yes wouldn't doing that also violate the actuaries code in some way also perhaps? It is not the first time in an application exam that IFoA have presented an unreal scenario and expect you to do something contrary to what's right or realistic. I don't see why such considerations are not picked up by the people who set these questions. There should be no ethical dilemma involved.
     
  14. David Wilmot

    David Wilmot ActEd Tutor Staff Member

    With regard to the September 2018 CP3 exam, I’m afraid it’s not ActEd’s role to comment on the suitability of any particular exam, or on issues with exam administration.

    However, it is ActEd’s role to help students maximise their chances of success when preparing for IFoA exams. Part of exam preparation is analysis of past examinations. So, looking at the September 2018 CP3 exam, it is clear that candidates sitting this exam would have been faced with a choice of either explaining the full premium basis, or explaining the difference between the price comparison site quote and the actual premium amount. If a candidate decided that it was not appropriate to explain the full basis, then the alternative approach of explaining the increase would be chosen. The marking schedule (published within in the Examiners' Report) allows candidates to take either of these two possible routes and score fully – specifically the [9] section in the marking schedule credits the approach of explaining the increase. In this way the examiners have accommodated the fact that the objectives in communicating might be achieved in different ways and have designed the marking schedule accordingly.

    We are currently working on our ASET for CP3, and hope that it will be available early in 2019. It will cover all the past CP3 exams along with the Specimen exam.
     
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  15. ahujas

    ahujas Member

    I didn't get the email either and wasted 20 minutes in getting the paper. I am well annoyed with the IFoA's decision of globally reducing the pass mark as I am aware of students who were able to download the paper at 10! I was 3 marks off so thinking of appealing the decision
     
  16. WeHaveSalah

    WeHaveSalah Member

    Diplomatically done... But at the end of the day, marks shouldn't be awarded for giving away intellectual property and rating calculations. It is unethical and unrealistic.
     
    almost_there likes this.
  17. PeteC

    PeteC Active Member

    Got my SAR back

    The first marker gave me 54 and the second marker gave me 62.5
    This would be an average of 58.25 and a pass. However, it got reviewed and the reviewer gave me 57.5 (which was used as the awarded mark)

    Makes me feel sick the way these are marked and passes are obtained

    Any idea how the marking worked for this exam?

    I can only assume that it got remarked because one marker passed me, one failed me and the grade was close enough to (and below) 60 to be remarked. They then decided that a global 2% reduction should be applied because the pass rate will have been shambolic.

    If they applied that 2% reduction first then I may have been just passed and not looked at again!

    3 marks awarded for

    Document format

    • Clearly addressed to Miss Newcomber (Other forms of name are acceptable as long as sufficiently formal for a letter of this type, e.g. Angela Newcomber is acceptable, but just Angela would not be) [1]
    • Suitable title to document [½]
    • Including policy number [½]
    • Date [½]
    • and author [½]
    [Max 3]
    I had
    • Dear Mrs Newcomber
    • Clearly titled "Plan Number A9872123Z"
    • Dated
    • Signed off with name, title and contact information
    I scored 2/2.5/2.5

    Can anyone (at Acted) explain how this isn't awarded at least 2.5 and arguably 3 marks?
    I can just about understand losing 0.5 marks for not titling it "Re: Your query on A..." but that is just pedantry and arguably not as good.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2019
  18. Viki2010

    Viki2010 Member

    57.5 is an excellent result in the middle of the other 2 final marks. I remember getting a SAR in the past only to find out that the final mark awarded (not sure if that was a remark) is the lower of the two given.....what a joke! Also for CA3 in the past, I would see quite a big difference between marker 1 and marker 2, which proved that a lot of the content was highly subjective and hence more difficult to pass.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 3, 2019
  19. PeteC

    PeteC Active Member

    "Jargon and terminology"
    I scored 4/8/4 out of 12 here.

    Jargon [4]
    I used the term "Age next birthday" because in context it sounded better than "How old you will be on your next birthday".
    I used no other terms in the lists (other than BMI which I explained)

    Superfluous accuracy [3]
    The most I did was round to the nearest 5p when providing a breakdown of the increase in premium, and

    Absence of irrelevant points [5]
    I didn't have a single thing in the list provided in the Examiners Report (and I can't see where I mentioned two or more irrelevant points)

    I'll stop being angry about this one day. But I just can't see how the examiners can justify docking me 8 points in this part
     
  20. markf268

    markf268 Member

    I would suggest that you could have just used "age" here - the definition of what age you are using is a technical point and really doesn't matter to the customer so can be written more concisely.
     
  21. PeteC

    PeteC Active Member

    Thanks for your suggestion. I suppose with age next birthday, which is how the policy is measured I thought in the present. As opposed to knocking a year off the the ages to make it the current age.

    One to think about next time
     

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