• We are pleased to announce that the winner of our Feedback Prize Draw for the Winter 2024-25 session and winning £150 of gift vouchers is Zhao Liang Tay. Congratulations to Zhao Liang. If you fancy winning £150 worth of gift vouchers (from a major UK store) for the Summer 2025 exam sitting for just a few minutes of your time throughout the session, please see our website at https://www.acted.co.uk/further-info.html?pat=feedback#feedback-prize for more information on how you can make sure your name is included in the draw at the end of the session.
  • Please be advised that the SP1, SP5 and SP7 X1 deadline is the 14th July and not the 17th June as first stated. Please accept out apologies for any confusion caused.

Calculators

S

Schnorbitz

Member
I feel this response from the Examinations Team needs its own thread. It's a shame that it takes a specific emailed question to get clarity from them (and not thought about the words they're writing in the education noticeboard)! Grrr, minor gripe. We are going to have to fork out on new calculators. Does anyone actually have one that's on the list?



From: G******
Sent: 14 June 2007 00:48
To: examinations
Subject: Calculators


Hello,

I apologise for troubling you, but I was a bit confused by the paragraph marked "Calculators" in the June 2007 Education Noticeboard.

You give a list of "permitted calculators". However, the list doesn't specify whether these calculators are the only permitted calculators, or whether they are merely examples of permitted calculators.

Specifically, in my case, I was wondering whether you could provide confirmation that the Casio FX 115W is still permitted. This was the specific model recommended at my university.

Thank you in advance for your help. Please accept my apologies if you've had to deal with multiple enquiries asking very similar questions.

Yours sincerely

G*****



Dear G*****


We can confirm that from 2008, only the following calculators will be permitted:

* Casio FX85MS
* Hewlett Packard HP9S
* Hewlett Packard HP 12C Platinum
* Sharp EL531WB
* Texas Instruments BA II Plus
* Texas Instruments TI-30XIIB

We appreciate the above restrictions will affect many students but we hope that it will ensure an equal and fair examination process for all.

The current calculator guidelines will apply for the examinations in September 2007 and details are available in the exam entry instructions that accompany each form.

Students are advised to familarise themselves with these guidelines together with the exam entry policies in the following section of our website: http://www.actuaries.org.uk/Display_Page.cgi?url=/students/exam_policies.html.



With best wishes

Lianne Nelder
Exams Administrator
 
So where is the best place to buy one of these from (either online or off line)? I've found the Casio FX85MS on Amazon for £10.30 + delivery. Can anyone find them cheaper? Unless the institute is going to buy them in bulk and sell them on to us at a discount ;)
 
does anyone know which of those calculators has the biggest screen width e.g so you can see multiple figures/additions
(e.g sort of like on a graphical)

also which cacuator does matrices?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Little Miss Actuary said:
So where is the best place to buy one of these from (either online or off line)? I've found the Casio FX85MS on Amazon for £10.30 + delivery. Can anyone find them cheaper? Unless the institute is going to buy them in bulk and sell them on to us at a discount ;)
Click to expand...

The Scoiety of Actuaries in the US sells calculators with the Society sticker. It costs more to buy compared to the open market!
 
I am very against this and I think this is a very poorly thought out idea from the institute. My suggestion would be to email the your local student rep, and ask them to query this at the Student Consultative Committee.
 
Once I emailed the response round the department today, all hell broke loose.

Our line manager sent off a very angry email to the examinations team.

If you bring a calculator that's not on the list to an exam, they're threatening to take down your candidate number, ARN and the model of calculator.

Now, if everyone were to take a different model of calculator to one on the list... or even two or three or more... including one that's definitely less up-to-date than what's on the list... plus a slide rule, and an abacus... then they'd soon regret foisting this awful, non-consulted bit of regulation on us.
 
is this really such a big deal? We've got plenty of notice and I doubt forking out £10 on a new calcualtor is going to hurt many actuarial students.

Anyone who needs to rely on a particular calculator to do calculations, probably doesn't understand the material as well a they should (although appreciate speed can help). (Now that could be interpreted in more than one way.)

Perhaps canvass for other equivalent calculators to be added to the list but it makes it much easier to police if there are specific makes on the list.
 
I selected a new calculator recently on the advice of an ActEd tutor (I needed one anyway and they recommended Casio fx-991ES) and really like it - thank you tutors :). I know that a lot of other people have the same device. The same calculators are available to everyone sitting the exams, so to my mind there already is a level playing field.

My annoyance are that:
1) There is no explanation of the reason for creating a list,
2) They have not given a breakdown of the functions that they specifically want to prevent us from using,
3) There is no information on what happens to someone who does not have a calculator from the list.

For example, are we not allowed to have a calculator that can perform matrix operations? Does this mean that at, say, the ST levels, the examiners want us to be spending time crunching through matrix multiplication manually when we could be showing understanding of the topics that are really being tested.

One last thought - it's £20 I'd be spending because I always carry 2 calculators to an exams. Is the institute taking commission from the calculator manufacturers?!
 
Schnorbitz said:
If you bring a calculator that's not on the list to an exam, they're threatening to take down your candidate number, ARN and the model of calculator.
Click to expand...

And then do what with this information?!

Currently the invigilators don't seem notice if someone uses a graphical calculator so from 2008 will they really know the difference between a Casio FX85MS and my Casio FX991MS? They look identical to me on the internet. If they don't enforce the current rules why are they tightening them up?? Are they going to go to each desk and read the model number? This will takes absolutely ages in big centres like London. And when will they do this? Are they going to check all the calculators before you start (and have to let you in about 20 min before the exam) or disturb you during your exam?

I'm not sure this has been thought through very well :rolleyes:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Muppet said:
Anyone who needs to rely on a particular calculator to do calculations, probably doesn't understand the material as well a they should (although appreciate speed can help). (Now that could be interpreted in more than one way.)
Click to expand...

That has to be the understatement of the day. I agree that a £10 outlay is not going to kill me but I now need to research which calculator to buy (albeit from a very small list) and then learn how to use the thing, shorcuts etc. A hassle I can do without.

As for turning up with an 'illegal' calculator and hoping no-one notices. I'm not going to take the risk and I suspect no-one else will. They seem to be checking ID quite efficiently and that was only introduced recently.
 
Hmm, do you think I'll get away with FX85ES?
If it has any clever features I don't know what they are and don't use them.

Agree with nornor, it's not the cost of buying a new calculator as much as the bother of learning how to use it. I had to learn to use a calculator for the first time in ten years when I started these exams, it's not something I ever do in real life.

Though if any of the ones on the list can do normal distribution functions I'd be tempted - interpolating tables always strikes me as a pointless waste of life.

If they're really going to apply such a restrictive list, aren't they going to have to change it regularly when those models stop being produced?
 
Yep they will have to update it periodically. But I can only see them adding so there isn't extra learning time involved.

At least they have given 7 months notice (assuming you start using a new machine after the Sep/Oct sitting).

As for invigilators, they have to check ID these days so I guess it will just add to their checklist. However unlike the ID, to be fair they can't do it during the exam. Imagine the horror if they took your machine just after you've input a big calc!!

We'll have to wait & see how they intend to validate it. Don't think it'll be decided yet.
 
The more I've thought about it the more I like the idea. The new policy levels the playing field in favour of luddites like me who have had the same calculator for eons. My trusty old Casio doesn't do matrix or interpolation etc and it means I'll be forced to get up to speed with the new functions that are allowed.
 
Here's an idea...

As someone who is a student, not yet employed by an actuarial firm, and hence on a tight budget, I don't agree much with the idea of sticking strictly to just that very small list.

I'm not in such a bad situation personally, I hasten to add. Some time before my first exam in April, I looked at the calculators I had, and decided they were too old and unreliable, so I went out to my local Auchan supermarket (the French Tesco more or less) and chose, at random, a TI30XIIB. Fine, I'm happy with it, and all that, but I struck lucky. I could easily have penny-pinched and chosen Auchan's own calculator, which is no different from the TI in its functions, but costs slightly less. That would have left me still having to buy a calculator when the list was put up.

I agree that uniformity and fairness should be ensured, but believe that the list should not be so restrictive: people owning calculators not on the list but virtually identical in function to those on the list should have the option of having their machines "vetted" by the exam board and the profession, and hence allow the list to have "equivalent" names added. This should allow things to remain fair while not costing people extra! It should not be difficult to set up a vetting scheme, involving submitting a calculator along with its specifications manual.
 
Little Miss Actuary said:
I would think that if you point this out to the Institute they would have to add it to the list :rolleyes: Send them the links you posted here.
Click to expand...

Sadly, I suspect this not to be the case. Otherwise why not allow all older versions of the casio fx85ms which have the same functionality or less.

It sounds like this has been introduced purely for the invigilators to check more easily which calculator you have and if it's allowed, hence the small list.

Personally, I don't see what the (profession's) big fuss is about. Unless your calculator has a big databank (which is expressly forbidden), then there's not much advantage to be gained over using any specific calculator. Otherwise everyone would use the same one! Admittedly there're some calculators which allow you to save some time, eg. normal function rather than looking up in tables. But I imagine this is limited to the earlier CTs. You still have to show appropriate working and that you know what you're doing, even if the answer pops out of the calculator or whether you counted things up on an abacus.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
It's fair enough to have a restrictive list to help the invigilators at exam centres, but I can't see them actually checking the model number.

The main gripe I have is that the Casio calculator I use, I've been using for about 10 years. I cannot get on at all with the new Casio models - every time I try and save a number it repeats the last operator if there's an "Ans" in there.

It's funny that the HP12c is allowed. Fair enough that it's completely backwards to use, but it can do a whole host of financial calculations.

I'm going to scrape off the model number on mine and replace it with FX-85M or whatever it is ;)
 
Note that the allowed casio has changed from what was on the education noticeboard, so make sure you buy the right one.
 
Naboo - your problem with storing numbers in the memory is easy to fix. Once you have calculated a value that you want to store press ANS before trying to store it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top